Howzit,

My first post so 'hi' to all.

Nissan has confirmed that the TITAN will be out with a Diesel in late 2006. Has anyone heard if the same engine will be offered in the ARMADA?

Cheers,
Neal

I hope so. That would be outstanding! These things pull like a mother... now. I could just imagine what that would tow like.
Syko

Howzit,

My first post so 'hi' to all.

Nissan has confirmed that the TITAN will be out with a Diesel in late 2006. Has anyone heard if the same engine will be offered in the ARMADA?

Cheers,
Neal

Welcome to our little corner of cyberspace! Say, could you put us onto where you got the confirmation? Is there a link we can go to read about this? Thanks.

Welcome to our little corner of cyberspace! Say, could you put us onto where you got the confirmation? Is there a link we can go to read about this? Thanks.

May Truck Trend magazine.

Yeah, no problem. I hope to have an Armada in the garage pretty soon. I am waiting to hear about a Diesel before I commit.

I'm still trying to find out if Nissan will have an Armada diesel late in 2006. If it offers 25% better fuel economy and great towing capabilities it would be a sure-fire seller.

Europeans are reaping the benefits of new diesel technology and we in the US are still asking why? I just drove the M/B 320 I6 CDi and this car is lightning quick and gets 35mpg. The Jeep Liberty I4 CDi is a best seller in it's class and also has a world renowned Mercedes engine powering it.

Now if we can get passed the 'heavy-duty' mentality here and ask for regular diesel engines at regular passenger pricing we may have a chance at seeing them here. However, if we buy into the 'heavy-duty' sell we will end up paying for it. In Europe gas and diesels are within hundreds of dollars of each other, not thousands!

I can't wait until gas gets to $80 per barrel. I want the efficiency of a diesel now!

I have been lurking on this site since late last year in anticipation of getting my own Armada LE 4x4 Deep Red Brawn (I like your style TripleBlack) Diesel. Well as of 15 minutes ago my sales contact at a local Nissan dealer just received word back from Nissan Corp. office that yes indeed there will be a diesel engine offered for the 2007 Armada which should arrive on lots late 2006! They would not release any further info on the subject at this time.

P.S. I love this site and think you all have taught me so much. I am ready to get my Armada and start my own upgrades. My wife wishes I go and get one now and not wait, but this news is giving me more patience to wait. What do you think?

...What do you think?

I think we will see $80 per gallon before we see the Diesel Armada the rate gas prices are rising.

I plan to wait until there is a Diesel Armada and will utilise my existing vehicles until then. We are probably looking at 12 to 18 months wait but what the heck, I can just bare it.

I just hope Nissan has the sense to price the Diesel alongside it's gasoline stablemate and not go for a heavy-duty sell.

i can almost guarentee the diesel will have a $5k premium, minimum. Mileage will probably go from 15 mpg gas to 20 MPG diesel, at 15k miles a year @ $3.00 gallon equals a payback period of 6.66 years, not even considering the time value of money (which would probably move the payback closer to 8 years). Point is, unless you NEED, or WANT diesel for towing, or the "cool" factor etc, in todays world the monetary payback isnt there, unless you plan on keeping your Armada for at least 7 years or more. Once diesels become more popular or are priced in line with gassers, it will be a no brainer.

i can almost guarentee the diesel will have a $5k premium, minimum. Mileage will probably go from 15 mpg gas to 20 MPG diesel, at 15k miles a year @ $3.00 gallon equals a payback period of 6.66 years, not even considering the time value of money (which would probably move the payback closer to 8 years). Point is, unless you NEED, or WANT diesel for towing, or the "cool" factor etc, in todays world the monetary payback isnt there, unless you plan on keeping your Armada for at least 7 years or more. Once diesels become more popular or are priced in line with gassers, it will be a no brainer.

The fact that you are consuming less fuel will make the difference. If we all made a 25% savings commitment the price of fuel will come down.

i can almost guarentee the diesel will have a $5k premium, minimum. Mileage will probably go from 15 mpg gas to 20 MPG diesel, at 15k miles a year @ $3.00 gallon equals a payback period of 6.66 years, not even considering the time value of money (which would probably move the payback closer to 8 years). Point is, unless you NEED, or WANT diesel for towing, or the "cool" factor etc, in todays world the monetary payback isnt there, unless you plan on keeping your Armada for at least 7 years or more. Once diesels become more popular or are priced in line with gassers, it will be a no brainer.

If you assume Diesel is 20% less per gallon then it's only a little over 4 yrs to recoup. Plus I would think the resale would be better? I'll start looking at the 08's if they come out in 07. As many problems as I've had with the 04 I'll let them experiment on someone else for a year:). (even with all the problems I would still buy another over any other on the market, luckily most of my problems have been on the interior and not the mechanical)

Diesels are AWESOME for tuning.....plug-n-play adjustable tuners galore! turbo diesel = more power cheaper....

Diesel is more than Super Unleaded right now, and it seems like its been that way for quite a while (a couple years, at least its been more than regular unleaded). Resale will definitely be higher, but I doubt by the amount of the difference in purchase. In my mind anything greater than a 2.5 year payback wouldnt be worth it financially. That being said I'd pay the extra money because I'd love the torque to pull my boat, nothingbeats a diesel for towing.

That is why I'm interested in the diesel...for towing. I have been eying a 33' TT. I love their pulling and hauling power! Also, yes, I do plan on keeping her for a long time. I'm one who keeps his toys until the wheels fall off. Also I believe the savings of not having to buy a bigger tow vehicle that I do not like and isn't practical for me is well worth a $5K uplift if the torque and other specs are right. Besides if I can get the same beauty with more junk in the trunk, then I'm a happy man!

i....@ $3.00 gallon equals a payback period of 6.66 years

That's satanic :temphot:

The payback is instantaneous as you begin to conserve fuel immediately. The cost of gas is set to rise anyway if we keep up our current consumption rates.

I saw a slot on TV last night with some lady standing next to her Armada at a fuel stop telling the camera that she intends to get rid of the gas guzzler right away!

We need those Diesels ASAP or we can kiss big SUV's goodbye.

yes even tho payback is right away what he meant was that it takes up to 6 years before you "actually" start saving on gas. 1st you have to make up all the money you spent extra on the diesel engine, then you will see the saving :)

yes even tho payback is right away what he meant was that it takes up to 6 years before you "actually" start saving on gas. 1st you have to make up all the money you spent extra on the diesel engine, then you will see the saving :)

Trying to rationalize the savings in cash terms is the downfall. This is where all get hung-up. Logically this is what makes sense to us. However, the focus needs to be on reduced fuel consumption and not on what that immediate saving in reduction will get us.

Yes, If the price of gas is the same as diesel but the diesel is 25% more efficient we effectively pay 25% less for our gas. DON'T focus on the payment portion but on the amount of fuel you will consume. Our current rate of consumption will make the cost of fuel skyrocket over the next 6 years!

Motorcycles, Diesels and Hybrids are the immediate solution in consuming less.

Use less, we refine less, we pay less. :)

no. because even tho you will be saving on gas you will be paying more for your car/truck in 6 years period. if i buy an armada and you get say a diesel armada both new, you will be saving in gas a lot in 5 years, but again i will finish to pay my truck in 5 years at a lower price while you'll be paying for your truck... so you save on fuel but lose on the truck.. where is the point? if the diesel armada is 5k more than the fuel one... with those 5k i can buy a LOT of fuel right...??

on getting a hybrid car... i dont see it either. when servicing those cars you will be paying for 2 engines instead of 1. do a lil research on how much is the cost of maintenance of a hybrid. ;)

if you are THAT worried about payback for gas, you shouldnt have bought a 5.6L V8 in the first place ..... if the slight difference in price of diesel will break you right now, you shouldnt have an armada

Let's face it. Your cost/mile for FUEL for Diesel will be less that for gas because Diesel is more efficient(more MPG) You'll pay more for that because you want monster torque and/or to spend less at the pump each week. Total cost of ownership over the lifespan of the vehicle will depend on how long you own it and how well they maintain value. With that said, maybe with the diesel Armada they will have a REALLY BIG tow package with upgraded brakes!

As for Hybrids, I am just not convinced they don't cost the environment more than they help it. Big toxic batteries are just that, and take a lot of resources to manufacture and dispose of properly. If you want clean air, it would actually be cost effective to buy older cars that pollute SEVERAL HUNDRED / THOUSAND TIMES MORE than new reduced emission cars like Civics and TL's et al. to get those polluters off the road.

As for efficiency, the Armada is way more fuel efficient than the Ford 460 I sold, so it is all relative!

This all sounds great but only one thing...

By 2007 all new diesel vehicles will have to comply with Tier 2 emission regulations, which btw are more strict than thoses in Europe. And so far not one diesel veichle has actually passed the test. As such diesels like the Volkswagen Touareg V10 diesel and the Jeep Liberty diesel will leave the American market for 2007 (Information based on that from Car and Driver).

I guess we'll just have to wait and see how this all pans out.

Read it and weep:

LR3 Diesel in US: http://car-reviews.automobile.com/news/should-land-rover-bring-fuel-efficient-diesel-lr3-to-north-america/223/

Diesel better than Hybrid: http://www.motoring.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=2848359&fSectionId=751&fSetId=381

Clean Diesel: http://autointell-news.com/News-2005/May-2005/May-2005-4/May-25-05-p3.htm & http://www.daimlerchrysler.com/Projects/c2c/cda/c2c_DCComPrint/1,,0-5-7154-1-447972-1-0-0-447342-0-0-135-7145-0-0-0-0-0-0-0,00.html

The way things are going and green diesel due in 2007 I think they are here to stay. The company that I work for has just invested billions in ethanol and bio-diesel plants.

I can't wait for the Armada Diesel !

wudnt the diesel armada be noisy? because everytime i hear a diesel man!! sounds so loud!!! :cool:

wudnt the diesel armada be noisy? because everytime i hear a diesel man!! sounds so loud!!! :cool:

Not any more. Take the Jeep Liberty CDi or M/B E320 CDi for a spin! The Jetta TDi is awesome too!

The payback is instantaneous as you begin to conserve fuel immediately. The cost of gas is set to rise anyway if we keep up our current consumption rates.

I saw a slot on TV last night with some lady standing next to her Armada at a fuel stop telling the camera that she intends to get rid of the gas guzzler right away!

We need those Diesels ASAP or we can kiss big SUV's goodbye.

I think you're talking about this woman wanting to get rid of her Armada. The bottom line is everyone gets hurt at the gas station, not just big SUV's.

http://www.comcast.net/providers/fan/popup.html?v=39248976&pl=39311095.xml&config=/config/common/fan/default.xml

...The bottom line is everyone gets hurt at the gas station, not just big SUV's...l]

No, the person consuming less gets hurt more. They have to share the burden of those consumers pushing up the price because of their gas-guzzling ways. :eek:

Posted this on the QX forum but thought it made for interesting reading. New Mercedes GL 7 seater SUV: http://www.emercedesbenz.com/Dec05/09MoreDeatailsOnTheGL.html

The 420 CDi V8 looks awesome: http://www.germancarfans.com/news.cfm/newsid/2050518.006
0-60 in 6.1 seconds
150 mph (limited)
315 Hp
540 Lb-ft
25mpg !!!

...Can't wait for the Armada diesel!

but i thought diesel would have a big improvement on mpg, of at least 5mpg but to see that would get an increase of maybe 15 city 20 highway is a bit crazy.. that will be an gain of 2-3 miles per gallon!! all im asking is please dont let the armada be as noisy as the excursion!! :D

They are bound to put in an old fashioned Cummins diesel or similar. The modern common rail European diesels are all small capacity, no good for a big SUV (unless you count the new VW V10 TDi in the toureg).
I don't think the market is big enough for diesels in the States untill you get used to them over the next few years. I reckon you would be looking at 2010 or 2012 until its worth them developing a modern, large size, quiet, fuel efficient diesel.

I had a 2.0L Mondeo Diesel on hire when I was at home in the UK last summer, 54 mpg at 80 mph on the highway and around 40/45 mpg in town.

but i thought diesel would have a big improvement on mpg, of at least 5mpg but to see that would get an increase of maybe 15 city 20 highway is a bit crazy.. that will be an gain of 2-3 miles per gallon!! all im asking is please dont let the armada be as noisy as the excursion!! :D

You're looking at a minimum of 25% savings over the gasoline engine. It will likely be a lot more.

Either the 3L 320 CDi V6 or the 4L 420 CDi V8 would be a great engine. If Nissan goes the old-school Cummins route it would be a mistake.

You're looking at a minimum of 25% savings over the gasoline engine. It will likely be a lot more.

Either the 3L 320 CDi V6 or the 4L 420 CDi V8 would be a great engine. If Nissan goes the old-school Cummins route it would be a mistake.

but with an increase of about 25% will be something like 3 extra miles per gallon... i still dont see a big diff. now if they do start building armadas with diesel engines capable of doing 20mpg on city then ill be 1st in line to get it :)

but with an increase of about 25% will be something like 3 extra miles per gallon... i still dont see a big diff. now if they do start building armadas with diesel engines capable of doing 20mpg on city then ill be 1st in line to get it :)
I will take 25% mileage increase any day, that is like 75 miles more per tank.

Diesel in Los Angeles is $2.79 vs. Regular 87 at $2.29
Are you all seeing this big of a difference in other parts of the U.S.?
With a 21% premium for diesel, where is the benefit economically? I know there's more torque and all that, but for those of us who don't tow, is it really a better way to go?
I'm not trying to be Debbie Downer, just trying to understand what would drive demand for diesels.
There must be demand of companies like Nissan are now investing in this approach.

Diesel in Los Angeles is $2.79 vs. Regular 87 at $2.29
Are you all seeing this big of a difference in other parts of the U.S.?
With a 21% premium for diesel, where is the benefit economically? I know there's more torque and all that, but for those of us who don't tow, is it really a better way to go?
I'm not trying to be Debbie Downer, just trying to understand what would drive demand for diesels.
There must be demand of companies like Nissan are now investing in this approach.
im in too!! diesel here is 2.79 a gallon vs 2.25 regular 89. paying 0.54 extra for the diesel times 28 is 15.12 dollars extra per tank... where is the saving?? :confused:

If it is like a Cummins it will last 300k miles easily, pulling heavy loads, gas engines will not. I don't think the price disparity will be this great forever, with Europe going diesel, more refineries will be producing more and more diesel and less gas and with diesel being cheaper to produce it may be the other way soon or at least even. The owners who tow will reap most of the benefits.

im in too!! diesel here is 2.79 a gallon vs 2.25 regular 89. paying 0.54 extra for the diesel times 28 is 15.12 dollars extra per tank... where is the saving?? :confused:

If diesel is 25% more but you use 25% less there is no immediate savings. The difference is a wash. The big thing is that you conserve 25% more fuel and this will drive down demand. At present the refieneries are maxed out with demand outstripping supply. Also, with service intervals at twice and some at three times that of a gasoline engine you will save here too.

My only concern here in the US is that companies will try and attach a 'heavy duty' label to thier diesels and jack up the price. In Europe the price-difference is negligible.

Just give me, like the do in Mercedes, the option of a diesel. that's all I ask. :excellent

The spread between diesel and gas has just widened.
$2.12 for 87 octane gas, $2.98 for diesel in Los Angeles.

I feel bad for all the big rig drivers trying to make a living hauling stuff around. Companies like Walmart don't have an ounce of sympathy for anything but their bottom line.

The spread between diesel and gas has just widened.
$2.12 for 87 octane gas, $2.98 for diesel in Los Angeles.

I feel bad for all the big rig drivers trying to make a living hauling stuff around. Companies like Walmart don't have an ounce of sympathy for anything but their bottom line.
yes that is true.. even thou diesels are coming is gonna be a long way before we see some real savings on diesel.

One of the misconception of diesel production is that with more consumption, more diesel will be refined. You can only refine 7 gallons of diesel from one 42 gallon barrel of oil. More diesel means more oil. In the past, diesel was cheaper because it was considered a byproduct of gas production, now the role is reversing with the growth in use (ships, trains, power generation plants, passenger cars, etc).
The only savior will be bio-diesel. Cleaner to burn and doesn't depend on the middle east for production quotas. A little incentive from Uncle Sam would be nice as well. My hope is the Armada Diesel will allow for Bio-Diesel like the Jeep Liberty does. Sorry if I sounded all scientific, it was not my intention.

I'll bite on this discussion...

According to the American Petroleum Institute, you get 19.4 gallons of gas and 9.7 gallons of diesel from a barrel of oil, plus a lot of other types of products ... but you get all from the same barrel of oil.

So you're right - more consumption requires more production, but if you yield greater fuel economy from the same barrel of oil and you can achieve that economy with reduced emissions (because diesel refining is less energy intensive and newer diesel engines are burning cleaner) - then diesel is saving oil.

I have an F350 Dually Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, and it's great. A diesel Armada done the American way,is not practical. You know they are going to do it like every other "heavy duty" diesel out there. Unless they strengthen the frame, beef up the suspension, get bigger air bags, increase brake size, new tranny, new transfer case, new differentials, bigger altenator for the 2 batteries, etc. what good will it do you..and at what co$t?? That's not even getting into the monster towing capabilities vs. short wheelbase issues this new monster will face. If you need to tow that much, an Armada is not the vehicle for you. The diesel is great, but it's huge $$$ upfront and unless you tow HEAVY and OFTEN, it's not a good return. The mileage gains will barely cover the cost increase of diesel, epecailly in the cold climates when home heating oil starts flowing. About the only way you WILL save $$, is to illegally burn the untaxed home heating oil in the Armada.

As far as longetvity, that gets tricky as well. If the engine lasts 300K, will you have replced everything else on the car by then??? Ever pay for a big auto tranny on a diesel truck or a big rear diff...I have and it's not pretty!

The diesel rattle is nice in my F350, it wouldn't be as great in a classy looking Armada. My wife loves the F350, but in the family SUV...I don't think so.

I have an F350 Dually Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, and it's great. A diesel Armada done the American way,is not practical. You know they are going to do it like every other "heavy duty" diesel out there. Unless they strengthen the frame, beef up the suspension, get bigger air bags, increase brake size, new tranny, new transfer case, new differentials, bigger altenator for the 2 batteries, etc. what good will it do you..and at what co$t?? That's not even getting into the monster towing capabilities vs. short wheelbase issues this new monster will face. If you need to tow that much, an Armada is not the vehicle for you. The diesel is great, but it's huge $$$ upfront and unless you tow HEAVY and OFTEN, it's not a good return. The mileage gains will barely cover the cost increase of diesel, epecailly in the cold climates when home heating oil starts flowing. About the only way you WILL save $$, is to illegally burn the untaxed home heating oil in the Armada.

As far as longetvity, that gets tricky as well. If the engine lasts 300K, will you have replced everything else on the car by then??? Ever pay for a big auto tranny on a diesel truck or a big rear diff...I have and it's not pretty!

The diesel rattle is nice in my F350, it wouldn't be as great in a classy looking Armada. My wife loves the F350, but in the family SUV...I don't think so.
I agree. There's not many trucks out there my Armada bows down to, but the F350 has my respect.

I have an F350 Dually Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, and it's great. A diesel Armada done the American way,is not practical. You know they are going to do it like every other "heavy duty" diesel out there. Unless they strengthen the frame, beef up the suspension, get bigger air bags, increase brake size, new tranny, new transfer case, new differentials, bigger altenator for the 2 batteries, etc. what good will it do you..and at what co$t?? That's not even getting into the monster towing capabilities vs. short wheelbase issues this new monster will face. If you need to tow that much, an Armada is not the vehicle for you. The diesel is great, but it's huge $$$ upfront and unless you tow HEAVY and OFTEN, it's not a good return. The mileage gains will barely cover the cost increase of diesel, epecailly in the cold climates when home heating oil starts flowing. About the only way you WILL save $$, is to illegally burn the untaxed home heating oil in the Armada.

As far as longetvity, that gets tricky as well. If the engine lasts 300K, will you have replced everything else on the car by then??? Ever pay for a big auto tranny on a diesel truck or a big rear diff...I have and it's not pretty!

The diesel rattle is nice in my F350, it wouldn't be as great in a classy looking Armada. My wife loves the F350, but in the family SUV...I don't think so.

Well said... :thumbup:

...A diesel Armada done the American way,is not practical. ... but in the family SUV...I don't think so.

Take a drive in the Mercedes E320 CDI and then make such a statement. :clueless:

It works great in this "classy" vehicle. Modern diesles are great, don't clatter, are fuel efficient and can tow.

Yes, if Nissan goes the "heavy duty" route then they are indeed doomed. Go the Mercedes way with a 4L common rail V8 turbo diesel and it will blast the opposition away. :machinegu

I love that you can put in a $100 chip in a diesel and get like 1000 more HP and 3000 more tq :)

I have heard though that Europe has better quality diesel than we do and that's why manufacturers do not sell many diesels here (this is from my BMW board).

Take a drive in the Mercedes E320 CDI and then make such a statement. :clueless:

It works great in this "classy" vehicle. Modern diesles are great, don't clatter, are fuel efficient and can tow.

Yes, if Nissan goes the "heavy duty" route then they are indeed doomed. Go the Mercedes way with a 4L common rail V8 turbo diesel and it will blast the opposition away. :machinegu

Well they way I figure it, with the Armada already sporting a 300+ HP gasser pushing almost 400lbs of torque they have to put something around the same HP and around 500 lbs of torque to make it worthwhile for a BIG enough towing difference (like the 5.9 Cummings of a few years ago #s). Since this is a made in America for Americans, SUV...you guessed it they will jump at the chance to put in a 5000- 6000 dollar optional HD diesel.

I hope I am wrong. I just don't see Nissan pumping alot of R&D dollars into a diesel Armada, and then giving us an inexpensive long lasting diesel when they know the "HD" diesels bring big $$$$ as options.

Only time will tell :)

These are the stats of the 4L M/B 420CDI V8 common-rail diesel:

0-60 in 6.1 seconds
150 mph (limited)
315 Hp
540 Lb-ft
25mpg !!!

The 3L V6 320CDI puts out 240 hp and 300 lb-ft.

Perfect for an SUV like the Armada.

These are the stats of the 4L M/B 420CDI V8 common-rail diesel:

0-60 in 6.1 seconds
150 mph (limited)
315 Hp
540 Lb-ft
25mpg !!!

The 3L V6 320CDI puts out 240 hp and 300 lb-ft.

Perfect for an SUV like the Armada.

Yeah I agree, it would be great. I'd be buying one if they were available at a DECENT price. I think there are many other factors to consider.

Certainly pumping 540lbs of torque through the currently configured Armada isn't going to work...for long at least. I 'm no engineer but I think those sort of figures are going to need a total redesign. That's some serious grunt through an SUV. I know the Armada is designed on a truck platform, but it's a 1/2 ton truck platform. The Excursion with diesel was a 250/350 frame and driveline, it's a BIG difference. If it's not unheard of to grenade a Dana 80 rear axle with those sort of figures in an F350, what do think will happen to an Armadas Dana 44??? You can upgrade that easily enough, but that's just one item, when you start upgrading everything to handle the power it will get EXPENSIVE.

I think if Nissan is going to leave things BASICALLY as is in the Titan (and maybe the Armada at a later date)they will have to shoot for more modest performance gains. Then you run into the cost/benefit of modest gains.

As far as the MB motor, what are the odds Nissan gets an engine from Daimler Chrysler, wouldn't we see it in a Durango first??? My money is on the typical diesel we see in Ford/Chevy/GM...lots of power but expensive and not great on fuel. Even if they did create or buy a similar engine from some other manufacturer, what would the cost be. Nobody seems to give the diesels away here in the U.S. Dodge was supposed to try charging $5400 for a VW diesel in motor in much smaller vehicle than ours. Jeep aint' giving them away either. :rolleyes:

Sounds like 2009 for diesel based on this article (http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060314/FREE/60313009/1041/SEARCH)

However this one sounds like 2008 based on this one (http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060307/FREE/60306005&SearchID=73238475904198)?